GT: Just Got off Skype with My Contractor Friend….He gave me a QUiCK Update from Iraq. He was told Abadi made the GOI Announcement Today (he didn’t have any more Details & Didn’t have a lot of time)!! He DID SAY people were “PARTYING UP” Now for you NON-BELIEVERS!! Don’t ask for ANYMORE PROOF because their is none I can give other than what I just told!!! So THERE YOU GO…

Publicado por Dinaresgurus.blogspot.com FORO DINAR GURUS en 8:48


MARK WAGONEER: Exo: you stated you showed all live rates. No announcement will be made. So we are just waiting for Santa, is that the last piece







Guesses to Exogen’s Picture Clue/Intel

nana7 October 21, 2014 at 9:40pm

Tuesday Night…..

A few puzzles to solve.

Optical illusions everywhere and are playing tricks on your eyes.

Some are illusions and are hiding in plain site

Iraq RV’d on Oct. 20, hiding in plain site. Lower Denoms live NOW!!

Look for clues the rates are sneaking in

IDN- $9 VNN-$2.57 IQN- $4 Zim- .15

WoooHooo…It’s snowing again and Santa is coming to town!!


It Will Take 398,879,561 Years To Pay Off The US Government’s Debt


Submitted by Simon Black of Sovereign Man blog,

The US government’s debt is getting close to reaching another round number—$18 trillion. It currently stands at more than $17.9 trillion.

But what does that really mean? It’s such an abstract number that it’s hard to imagine it. Can you genuinely understand it beyond just being a ridiculously large number?

Just like humans find it really hard to comprehend the vastness of the universe. We know it’s huge, but what does that mean? It’s so many times greater than anything we know or have experienced.

German astronomer and mathematician Friedrich Bessel managed to successfully measure the distance from Earth to a star other than our sun in the 19th century. But he realized that his measurements meant nothing to people as they were. They were too abstract.

So he came up with the idea of a “light-year” to help people get a better understanding of just how far it really is. And rather than using a measurement of distance, he chose to use one of time.

The idea was that since we—or at least scientists—know what the speed of light is, by representing the distance in terms of how long it would take for light to travel that distance, we might be able to comprehend that distance.

Ultimately using a metric we are familiar with to understand one with which we aren’t.

Why don’t we try to do the same with another thing in the universe that’s incomprehensibly large today—the debt of the US government?

Even more incredible than the debt owed right now is what’s owed down the line from all the promises politicians have been making decade after decade. These unfunded liabilities come to an astonishing $116.2 trillion.

These numbers are so big in fact, I think we might need to follow Bessel’s lead and come up with an entire new measurement to grasp them.

Like light-years, we could try to understand these amounts in terms of how long it would take to pay them off. We can even call them “work-years”.

So let’s see—the Social Security Administration just released data for the average yearly salary in the US in fiscal year that just ended. It stands at $44,888.16.

The current debt level of over $17.9 trillion would thus take more than 398 million years of working at the average wage to pay off.

This means that even if every man, woman and child in the United States would work for one year just to help pay off the debt the government has piled on in their name, it still wouldn’t be enough.

Mind you that this means contributing everything you earn, without taking anything for your basic needs—which equates to slavery.

Now, rather than saying that the national debt is reaching $18 trillion, which means nothing to most people, you could say that the debt would currently take almost 400 million work-years to pay off. Wow.

When accounting for unfunded liabilities, the work-years necessary to pay off the debt amount to astonishing 2.38 BILLION work-years…

And the years of slavery required are only growing.

As an amount alone the debt is meaningless, but in terms of your future enslavement it can be better understood.

To put this in perspective even further—what was the situation like previously?

At the end of the year 2000, the national debt was at $5.7 trillion, while the average yearly income was $32,154. That’s 177 million work-years.


So just from the turn of the century, we’ve seen the time it would take to pay off the national debt more than double. That means that more than twice as many future generations have been indebted to the system in just 14 years.

It sounds terrible, and it is. But remember, your future generations will only be indebted if you let them be.

What the US government does may affect everyone, but it’s up to you whether or not you and your children are directly enslaved and tied to the system.

Break your chains while you can and set yourself and your offspring free.


As Companies Seek Tax Deals, Governments Pay High Price By LOUISE STORY



As Companies Seek Tax Deals, Governments Pay High Price Fred R. Conrad/The New York Times
General Motors pushed hard for tax breaks in Ypsilanti Township, Mich. Some $200 million later, this is what remains. More Photos »
Published: December 1, 2012 728 Comments
In the end, the money that towns across America gave General Motors did not matter.
Slide Show Big Tax Incentives, Little Returns. Border War: Kansas CityBorder War: Kansas CityClose VideoSee More Videos » .
Connect With Us on TwitterFollow @NYTNational for breaking news and headlines.
Twitter List: Reporters and Editors
When the automaker released a list of factories it was closing during bankruptcy three years ago, communities that had considered themselves G.M.’s business partners were among the targets.
For years, mayors and governors anxious about local jobs had agreed to G.M.’s demands for cash rewards, free buildings, worker training and lucrative tax breaks. As late as 2007, the company was telling local officials that these sorts of incentives would “further G.M.’s strong relationship” with them and be a “win/win situation,” according to town council notes from one Michigan community.
Yet at least 50 properties on the 2009 liquidation list were in towns and states that had awarded incentives, adding up to billions in taxpayer dollars, according to data compiled by The New York Times.
Some officials, desperate to keep G.M., offered more. Ohio was proposing a $56 million deal to save its Moraine plant, and Wisconsin, fighting for its Janesville factory, offered $153 million.
But their overtures were to no avail. G.M. walked away and, thanks to a federal bailout, is once again profitable. The towns have not been so fortunate, having spent scarce funds in exchange for thousands of jobs that no longer exist.
Ask a Question
Louise Story will be responding to your questions about business incentives. Ask your question in the comments section below.

One township, Ypsilanti, Mich., is suing over the automaker’s departure. “You can’t just make these promises and throw them around like they’re spare change in the drawer,” said Doug Winters, the township’s attorney.
Yet across the country, companies have been doing just that. And the giveaways are adding up to a gigantic bill for taxpayers.
A Times investigation has examined and tallied thousands of local incentives granted nationwide and has found that states, counties and cities are giving up more than $80 billion each year to companies. The beneficiaries come from virtually every corner of the corporate world, encompassing oil and coal conglomerates, technology and entertainment companies, banks and big-box retail chains.

The cost of the awards is certainly far higher. A full accounting, The Times discovered, is not possible because the incentives are granted by thousands of government agencies and officials, and many do not know the value of all their awards. Nor do they know if the money was worth it because they rarely track how many jobs are created. Even where officials do track incentives, they acknowledge that it is impossible to know whether the jobs would have been created without the aid.
“How can you even talk about rationalizing what you’re doing when you don’t even know what you’re doing?” said Timothy J. Bartik, a senior economist at the W.E. Upjohn Institute for Employment Research in Kalamazoo, Mich.
The Times analyzed more than 150,000 awards and created a searchable database of incentive spending. The survey was supplemented by interviews with more than 100 officials in government and business organizations as well as corporate executives and consultants.
A portrait arises of mayors and governors who are desperate to create jobs, outmatched by multinational corporations and short on tools to fact-check what companies tell them. Many of the officials said they feared that companies would move jobs overseas if they did not get subsidies in the United States.
Related Coverage
Roundtable on Incentives on “To The Point” (KCRW)
December 6, 2012
Interview on Incentives on “Fresh Air” (NPR)
December 5, 2012
Call it the Latest Deal in Kansas City Border War (The Kansas City Star)
December 5, 2012
How State Incentives Affect the Nation
December 4, 2012
Tax Battle in the Northeast
December 3, 2012

Over the years, corporations have increasingly exploited that fear, creating a high-stakes bazaar where they pit local officials against one another to get the most lucrative packages. States compete with other states, cities compete with surrounding suburbs, and even small towns have entered the race with the goal of defeating their neighbors.
While some jobs have certainly migrated overseas, many companies receiving incentives were not considering leaving the country, according to interviews and incentive data.
Despite their scale, state and local incentives have barely been part of the national debate on the economic crisis. The budget negotiations under way in Washington have not addressed whether the incentives are worth the cost, even though 20 percent of state and local budgets come from federal spending. Lawmakers in Washington are battling over possible increases in personal taxes, while both parties have said that lower federal taxes on corporations are needed for the country to compete globally.
The Times analysis shows that Texas awards more incentives, over $19 billion a year, than any other state. Alaska, West Virginia and Nebraska give up the most per resident.
For many communities, the payouts add up to a substantial chunk of their overall spending, the analysis found. Oklahoma and West Virginia give up amounts equal to about one-third of their budgets, and Maine allocates nearly a fifth.
$9.1 million
Amount local governments give up for business incentives every hour
$80 billion+
Amount local governments give up to businesses every year
Explore the Data »
Search our extensive database of business incentives awarded by state and local governments
In a few states, the cost of incentives is not significant. But several of them have low business taxes — or none at all — which can save companies even more money than tax credits.
Far and away the most incentive money is spent on manufacturing, about $25.5 billion a year, followed by agriculture. The oil, gas and mining industries come in third, and the film business fourth. Technology is not far behind, as companies like Twitter and Facebook increasingly seek tax breaks and many localities bet on the industry’s long-term viability.
Those hopes were once more focused on automakers, which for decades have pushed cities and states to set up incentive programs, blazing a trail that companies of all sorts followed. Even today, G.M. is the top beneficiary, public records indicate. It received at least $1.7 billion in local incentives in the last five years, followed closely by Ford and Chrysler.
A spokesman for General Motors said that almost every major employer applied for incentives because they help keep companies competitive and retain or create jobs.
“There are many reasons why so many Ford, Chrysler and G.M. plants closed over the last few decades,” said the G.M. spokesman, James Cain. “But these factors don’t mean that the companies and communities didn’t benefit while the plants were open, which was often for generations.”
Mr. Cain cited research showing that the company received less money per job than foreign automakers operating in the United States.
Questioned about incentives, officials at dozens of other large corporations said they owed it to shareholders to maximize profits. Many emphasized that they employ thousands of Americans who pay taxes and spend money in the local economy.
For government officials like Bobby Hitt of South Carolina, the incentives are a good investment that will raise tax revenues in the long run.
“I don’t see it as giving up anything,” said Mr. Hitt, who worked at BMW in the 1990s and helped it win $130 million from South Carolina.
Today, Mr. Hitt is the state’s secretary of commerce. South Carolina recently took on a $218 million debt to assist Boeing’s expansion there and offered the company tax breaks for 10 years.

“If you’re looking at the competitiveness of a region, the most important thing a region can do is to focus on education. And this use of incentives is really transferring money from education to businesses.”
Donald J. Hall Jr., Hallmark C.E.O.

Mr. Hitt, like most political officials, has a short-term mandate. It will take years to see whether the state’s bet on Boeing bears fruit.
In Michigan, Gov. Rick Snyder, a Republican in his first term, has been working to eliminate most business tax credits but is bound by past awards. The state gave General Motors $779 million in credits in 2009, just a month after the company received a $50 billion federal bailout and decided to close seven plants in Michigan.
G.M. can use the credits to offset its state tax bill for up to 20 years. “You don’t know who will take a credit or when,” said Doug Smith, a senior official at the state’s economic development agency. “We may give a credit to G.M., and they might not take it for three years or 10 years or more.”
One corporate executive, Donald J. Hall Jr. of Hallmark, thinks business subsidies are hurting his hometown, Kansas City, Mo., by diverting money from public education. “It’s really not creating new jobs,” Mr. Hall said. “It’s motivated by politicians who want to claim they have brought new jobs into their state.”
For Mr. Hall and others in Kansas City, the futility of free-flowing incentives has been underscored by a border war between Kansas and Missouri.
Soon after Kansas recruited AMC Entertainment with a $36 million award last year, the state cut its education budget by $104 million. AMC was moving only a few miles, across the border from Missouri. Workers saw little change other than in commuting times and office décor. A few months later, Missouri lured Applebee’s headquarters from Kansas.
“I just shake my head every time it happens, it just gives me a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach,” said Sean O’Byrne, the vice president of the Downtown Council of Kansas City. “It sounds like I’m talking myself out of a job, but there ought to be a law against what I’m doing.”
Outgunned by Companies
For local governments, incentives have become the cost of doing business with almost every business. The Times found that the awards go to companies big and small, those gushing in profits and those sinking in losses, American companies and foreign companies, and every industry imaginable.
Workers are a vital ingredient in any business, yet companies and government officials increasingly view the creation of jobs as an expense that should be subsidized by taxpayers, private consultants and local officials said.
Even big retailers and hotels, whose business depends on being in specific locations, bargain for incentives as if they can move anywhere. The same can be said for many movie productions, which almost never come to town without local subsidies.
When Oliver Stone made the 2010 sequel to “Wall Street,” in his mind there was only one place to shoot it: New York City. Nonetheless, the film, a scathing look at bankers’ greed, received $10 million in tax credits, according to 20th Century Fox.
In an interview, Mr. Stone criticized subsidies for industries like banking and agriculture but defended them for Hollywood, saying that many movies can be shot anywhere and that their actors and crew members pay state income taxes. “It’s good,” Mr. Stone said of the film subsidies. “Or like basically the way business is done. I don’t understand what the moral qualm is.”
The practical consequences can be easily seen. The Manhattan Institute for Policy Research, a conservative group, found that the amount New York spends on film credits every year equals the cost of hiring 5,000 public-school teachers.
Nationwide, billions of dollars in incentives are being awarded as state governments face steep deficits. Last year alone, states cut public services and raised taxes by a collective $156 billion, according to the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, a liberal-leaning advocacy group.
Incentives come in many forms: cash grants and loans; sales tax breaks; income tax credits and exemptions; free services; and property tax abatements. The income tax breaks add up to $18 billion and sales tax relief around $52 billion of the overall $80 billion in incentives.
Play video
Mac William Bishop/The New York Times
Border War: Kansas City
Collecting data on property tax abatements is the most difficult because only a handful of states track the amounts given by cities and counties. Among them is New York, where businesses save an estimated $1.1 billion a year in property taxes. The American International Group, the insurance company at the center of the 2008 financial crisis, continued to benefit from a $23.8 million abatement from New York City at the same time it was being bailed out with $180 billion in federal money.
Since 2000, The New York Times Company has received more than $24 million from the city and state.
In some places, local officials have little choice but to answer the demands of corporations.
“They dictate their terms, and we’re not really in a position to question their deal terms,” Sarah Eckhardt, a commissioner in Travis County, Tex., said of companies she has dealt with recently, including Apple and Hewlett-Packard. “We don’t have the sophistication or the resources to negotiate with a company that has the wherewithal the size of a country. We are just no match in negotiating with that.”
Local officials can find themselves across the table from conglomerates like Shell Oil and Caterpillar, the world’s largest maker of construction equipment.
Shell has been offered a tax credit worth as much as $1.6 billion over 25 years from Pennsylvania, which competed with West Virginia and Ohio for an energy production facility. Royal Dutch Shell, the parent company, made $31 billion in profits in 2011 — about $3.5 million every hour. The company’s chief executive made $13.1 million last year, according to Equilar, an executive compensation firm. Pennsylvania predicts that the plant will create thousands of long-term jobs, but it did not require them in exchange for the tax credit.
Caterpillar has received more than $196 million in local aid nationwide since 2007, though it has chastised states, particularly its home base, Illinois, for not being business-friendly. This year, Caterpillar announced a new plant in Georgia, which offered $44 million in incentives. Local counties chipped in free land and other aid, including $15 million in tax breaks and $8.2 million in road, water and sewer repairs.
The company, whose profits are soaring, recently froze workers’ pay for six years at several locations, arguing that it needed to remain competitive. A spokesman for the company, Jim Dugan, said it employed more than 50,000 people and invested billions of dollars nationwide.
Local officials typically have scant information about the track record of corporations, like whether they lived up to job assurances elsewhere. And some officials acknowledged that they did not know to what extent incentives were a deciding factor for companies.
“I don’t know that there’s a way to know other than talking to the businesses, and the businesses telling us that that was a factor in creating jobs,” said Ken Striplin, the city manager of Santa Clarita, Calif., which gives tax breaks in a designated enterprise zone. “There’s no box that says ‘I would have created this job without the enterprise zone.’ ”

Fred R. Conrad/The New York Times
“The management owes it to their stockholders to try to get the best economic deal that they can.”
Marilyn P. Nix, former G.M. real estate manager

California is one of the few states that have been cutting back on incentives. But that does not mean its cities are following suit. When Twitter threatened to leave San Francisco last year, officials scrambled to assuage the company.
Twitter was not short on money — it soon received a $300 million investment from a Saudi prince and $800 million from a private consortium. The two received Twitter equity, but San Francisco got a different sort of deal.
The city exempted Twitter from what could total $22 million in payroll taxes, and the company agreed to stay put. The city estimates that Twitter’s work force could grow to 2,600 employees, although the company made no such promise.
A Twitter spokeswoman said the company was “very happy to have been able to stay in San Francisco.” City officials did not respond to inquiries.
Like many places, San Francisco has been cutting its budget. Public parks have lost about $12 million in recent years, though workers at Twitter will not lack for greenery. The company’s plush new office has a rooftop garden with great views and amenities. Enjoying the perks, one employee sent out a tweet: “Tanned on Twitter’s new roof deck this morning as some dude served me smoothie shots. This is real life?”
A Zero-Sum Game
It was the company every state had to have. In 1985, General Motors was looking for a spot to manufacture its Saturn, a new compact car that would compete with Japanese imports and create thousands of American jobs.
Incentives were not in wide use, and several states had only recently begun to allow more of them.
In fact, when G.M. announced the search, its chairman, Roger Smith, said the perks would not be a predominant factor. “Tax breaks can’t make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear,” Mr. Smith told The Detroit Free Press. He said G.M. planned to avoid states that had large debts or lackluster schools.
Undeterred, some 30 states stepped forward in what became a full-out competition. One official, Bill Clinton, then the governor of Arkansas, traveled to Detroit offering income tax credits and sales tax exemptions worth nearly $200 million.

Mr. Smith essentially kept his word and chose Tennessee, which had put together a relatively small package. Reid Rundell, a retired G.M. executive, said in a recent interview that it had come down to geography. “The primary factor was distribution for incoming parts, as well as outgoing vehicles,” Mr. Rundell said.
But the gates had been opened. In 1992, South Carolina lured BMW with a $130 million package; the next year, Alabama got Mercedes-Benz at a price tag that topped $300 million.
“What the auto incentives did back then was really raise the profile of economic incentives both within companies, in government and in the public’s eye,” said Mark Sweeney, who worked for the South Carolina Commerce Department in the 1990s and now advises companies on obtaining government grants.
By 1993, governors were regaling one another at a national conference with stories of deals beyond the auto industry, including a recent bidding war for United Airlines that drew more than 90 cities. The airline had set up negotiations in a hotel, and its representatives ran floor to floor comparing bids, said Jim Edgar, then the governor of Illinois.
Mr. Edgar said he had called for a truce, concerned that the practice was unfair to companies that did not receive incentives. But many states would not sign on, he said, particularly those in the South, where businesses were moving.
“If you’ve got some states doing it, it’s hard for the others not to do it,” Mr. Edgar said. “It’s like unilaterally disarming.”
Soon after, economists at Federal Reserve branches were questioning the use of incentives. One, in Minnesota, used mathematical proofs and game theory to show that competition between states did not increase overall economic value. Several other economists have since called the practice a zero-sum game.
A group of taxpayers in Michigan and Ohio went as far as suing DaimlerChrysler after Ohio and the City of Toledo awarded the automaker $280 million in the late 1990s. The suit argued that it was unfair for one taxpayer to be given a break at the expense of all others.
The suit made its way to the Supreme Court, and G.M. and Ford signed on to briefs supporting Daimler, as did local governments. The National Governors Association warned the court that prohibiting incentives could lead to jobs moving overseas. “This is the economic reality,” the association said in a brief.
$170 billion
Combined amount federal and state governments give up for incentives
$1.1 trillion
Size of U.S. deficit in 2012
Look Up Your State »
Search our database to see how much your state awards in business incentivesChoose a stateAlabamaAlaskaArizonaArkansasCaliforniaColoradoConnecticutDelawareDistrict of ColumbiaFloridaGeorgiaHawaiiIdahoIllinoisIndianaIowaKansasKentuckyLouisianaMaineMarylandMassachusettsMichiganMinnesotaMississippiMissouriMontanaNebraskaNevadaNew HampshireNew JerseyNew MexicoNew YorkNorth CarolinaNorth DakotaOhioOklahomaOregonPennsylvaniaRhode IslandSouth CarolinaSouth DakotaTennesseeTexasUtahVermontVirginiaWashingtonWest VirginiaWisconsinWyoming
The governors offered no hard evidence of the effectiveness of tax credits, but the Supreme Court did not consider whether they worked anyway. In 2006, the court concluded that the taxpayers did not have the legal standing to challenge Ohio’s tax actions in federal court.
The tab for auto incentives has grown to $13.9 billion since 1985, according to the Center for Automotive Research, a nonprofit group in Ann Arbor, Mich. G.M., the top recipient, was awarded $3.3 billion of the aid. Since 1979, automakers also closed more than 267 plants in the United States, about half of which still sit empty, according to the center.
The auto industry and some local officials have long argued that auto companies create so many jobs and draw in so many supporting suppliers that all taxpayers benefit. Even if companies shut down years later, as Saturn did in Tennessee for a few years, the trade-off is worth it, they said.
“I do believe that if a state ever is going to create incentives,” said Lamar Alexander, who was Tennessee’s governor in 1985 when Saturn selected the state, “the auto industry would be by far the No. 1 target, because an auto assembly plant is a money target.”
Still, Mr. Alexander, now a United States senator, said that recruiting a large factory today would be more expensive. “It has changed a lot,” he said. “It’s almost become a sweepstakes.”
G.M. Gets Into the Act
G.M. may have initially minimized the role of local dollars, but as the company’s financial problems grew, incentives became a big part of its math.
The actions of the company were described in more than two dozen in-depth interviews with former company officials, tax consultants and governors and mayors who have dealt with G.M.
The automaker’s real estate division, Argonaut Realty, oversaw the hunt for the most lucrative deals. Up and down the corporate ladder, employees were encouraged to push governments for more, according to transcripts of public meetings and interviews. Even G.M. plant managers knew that the future of their facilities depended in part on their ability to send word of big discounts back to Detroit.
Union representatives were enlisted to attend local hearings, putting a human face on the jobs at stake. G.M.’s regional tax managers often showed up, armed with tax abatement wish lists and highlighting the company’s gifts to local charities.

Big Tax Incentives, Little Returns
“We knew what our investment of X amount meant to the community, and we knew we needed to partner with the community to be successful,” said Marilyn P. Nix, who worked as a real estate executive at G.M. for 31 years until retiring in 2005.
At the top of G.M., executives reviewed the proposals from various locations and went where the numbers added up.
“I know people like to blame the industry for taking advantage of the incentives, but you go back to what your fiduciary responsibility is to the stockholders,” Ms. Nix said. “As long as you’ve got people that are willing to better the deals, the management owes it to their stockholders to try to get the best economic deal that they can.”
For towns, it became a game of survival, even if the competition turned out to be a mirage.
Moraine, Ohio, was already home to a G.M. plant in 1997 when the company pushed hard for additional incentives. G.M. said it was looking for a place to accommodate more manufacturing.
Wayne Barfels, the city manager at the time, said a G.M. representative had told officials that Moraine was competing with Shreveport, La., and Linden, N.J. After the local school board approved property tax breaks, The Dayton Daily News reported that the other towns had not been in discussions with G.M.
The school board considered rescinding the deal, but allowed G.M. to keep it after a company official apologized. In 2008, G.M. shut the Moraine facility.
In towns where General Motors remains, local officials praised the company. “I can say they have been a great partner to us,” said Virg Bernero, the mayor of Lansing, Mich. “It would do something to the psyche of this community if they were not here. I mean, I just praise God every day.”
Looking to lure businesses beyond automakers, states have routinely bolstered their incentive tool kits. In 2010 alone, states created or expanded about 40 tax credits and exemptions, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures.
The nature of the credits has also changed. New ones are geared toward attracting technology and green energy companies, but it is hard to know whether 15 years down the road they will thrive or wind up stumbling like the automakers. And many modern companies, like those in digital technology, can easily pack up and leave.
“I don’t see anything that suggests that Twitter and Facebook are better bets in the long run,” said Laura A. Reese, the director of the Global Urban Studies Program at Michigan State University. Ms. Reese advises local governments to invest in residents through education and training rather than in companies where “it’s hard to pick winners.”

Fred R. Conrad/The New York Times
“These economic development deals with a company just serve to guarantee that the nation’s largest companies can receive tax breaks wherever they go.”
Sarah Eckhardt, county commissioner, Travis County, Texas

Yet states try to do it all the time. In 2010, Rhode Island, which has the nation’s second-highest unemployment rate, recruited Curt Schilling, a former Red Sox pitcher, to move his video game company from Massachusetts. The company, 38 Studios, had never released a game and was not making money, but the governor at the time had the state guarantee $75 million in loans.
The company failed and dismissed all of its roughly 400 workers this May. Rhode Island taxpayers are now on the hook for the loans.
Officials said part of the difficulty was that communities do not get much say in a company’s business strategy.
“We, as communities, stake our futures with these people who are supposed to know what they’re doing, and sometimes they don’t,” said Arthur Walker, a businessman in Shreveport and former chairman of the city’s chamber of commerce.
Mr. Walker and other officials in Shreveport know firsthand. In 2000, they were worried that G.M. would close a plant in their area and responded with a generous proposal: the city would cut the company’s gas bill and provide work force training grants. In addition, G.M. would benefit by a recent increase in one of the state’s income tax credits.
Eager to encourage innovation, Shreveport officials suggested ways the city could assist G.M. in building electric cars. “We wanted to be part of the future,” said Mr. Walker, whose brother worked at the plant.
G.M. took the city’s incentives but not its business advice and began building the giant Hummer there.
“We knew they needed to build green cars — I mean, who builds a Hummer for the 21st century?” Mr. Walker said. “It was a losing proposition that we found ourselves in. We couldn’t win because those people weren’t making the correct business decisions, in my view. When it didn’t work, we’re the ones left holding the bag.”
The Hummer was discontinued in 2010, and the Shreveport factory closed this August, the final victim of G.M.’s bankruptcy.
Ypsilanti’s Losing Battle
For much of the last 20 years, Doug Winters has been agitating for General Motors to be held accountable.
Percentage of years since 1995 that General Motors got local incentives
What G.M. Got »
The company was awarded incentives in at least 16 states
Mr. Winters, the attorney for Ypsilanti Township and several other places around Ann Arbor, has lived in Ypsilanti all his life. His grandmother labored at the local plant, Willow Run, during World War II, when it made bomber planes. People in town still proudly point out that a woman known as Rosie the Riveter worked there as well. After the war, when G.M. moved into the plant to manufacture its automatic transmission system, his father got a job.
Mr. Winters loves the history of Willow Run but hates what he views as corporate hypocrisy: G.M. asked for government help on the one hand and then appealed to free-market rationales for closing shop.
Over the years, Ypsilanti granted G.M. more than $200 million in incentives for two factories at Willow Run, Mr. Winters said. “They had put basically a stranglehold on the entire state of Michigan and other places across the country by just grabbing these tax abatements by the billions,” he said. “They were doing it with a very thinly disguised threat that if you don’t give us these tax abatements, then we’ll have to go somewhere else.”
Ypsilanti first sued G.M. in the 1990s to prevent the company from closing the factory at Willow Run that made the Chevrolet Caprice.
The town had granted the company tax incentives after the factory manager argued that G.M.’s ability to compete with other carmakers was at stake, documents in the lawsuit show. The tax break and “favorable market demand,” said the plant manager, Harvey Williams, would allow the automaker to “maintain continuous employment.”
Nevertheless, G.M. shut the factory. A lower court found in favor of Ypsilanti, but the ruling was reversed on appeal. The judge said that a company’s job assurances “cannot be evidence of a promise.”

Fred R. Conrad/The New York Times
“We’re their own private ATM. When they need money, they come begging, but when they don’t want oversight, they say ‘get out of the way.’”
Doug Winters, attorney for Ypsilanti Township, Mich.

In 2010, when the company closed the remaining factory at Willow Run, Mr. Winters sued again. This time, Ypsilanti argued that the automaker should have been forced to close overseas factories instead, especially since American taxpayers had bailed out G.M. In addition, Ypsilanti sought to recover money from G.M., saying the company had agreed to reimburse the town for some incentives if it left.
So far, Ypsilanti’s claims have not been addressed. They were complicated by G.M.’s bankruptcy, which allowed the carmaker to emerge as a new company and leave some of its liabilities and contractual obligations behind.
When asked whether the new G.M. has civic responsibilities to its former factory towns, Mr. Cain, the company spokesman, said: “Our obligation to the communities where we do business is to run a successful business. And when we prosper, it allows us to do more than just turn the lights on and make cars.”
He also said that since the bailout, “G.M. has invested more than $7.3 billion in its U.S. facilities, and we’ve created or retained almost 19,000 jobs in communities all over the country.”
Matthew P. Cullen, who oversaw real estate and economic development for G.M. until he left the company in 2008, said the automaker was aware of its impact on communities. He said that what happened with G.M. was the result of an entire industry changing and that there had been no bad intentions.
“If you go forward in good faith doing everything you can and make the investment, then you’re partners,” Mr. Cullen said. “Sometimes partnerships in business work, and they work for 60 years. And in some cases, they don’t, and it doesn’t make you a bad partner.”
Some towns that are still dealing with the fallout of plant closings might disagree. In Pontiac, Mich., tax revenues have fallen 40 percent since 2009 after the old G.M. knocked down buildings on its property, resulting in lower tax assessments, according to the city’s emergency manager.
In Ypsilanti, an entity set up to sell off G.M. property is marketing the plant as valuable. At the same time, it has been arguing for lower property taxes on the grounds that its plant is not worth much.
Ypsilanti’s supervisor, Brenda Stumbo, said the township would be stung hard by further revenue cuts. Ypsilanti has already slimmed down its Fire Department, and city workers are juggling multiple jobs. There are seven to 10 home foreclosures a week, giving the township the highest foreclosure rate in the county, Ms. Stumbo said.
“Can all of it be traced back to General Motors?” she said, listing auto suppliers that closed after G.M. did. “No, but a great deal of it can.”
Nonetheless, Ms. Stumbo said that if G.M. would bring jobs back to town, she would be willing to grant the company more incentives.
But Mr. Winters is not so sure. He said he would never support more incentives without stronger protections for Ypsilanti. “They’ve done a lot of damage to a lot of people and a lot of communities, and they’ve basically been given a clean slate,” he said. “It’s a ‘get out of jail free’ card.”

Lisa Schwartz and Ramsey Merritt contributed research.
louise@nytimes.com, @louisestory
Part Two
Winners and Losers in the Lone Star State
By Louise Story

Texas awards more incentives than any other state in the name of creating jobs. But questions arise over who is benefitting from the largess.
Part Three
When Hollywood Comes to Town
By Louise Story

A movie studio gets millions to set up shop in Pontiac, Mich., and taxpayers get a starring role.
A version of this article appears in print on December 2, 2012, on page A1 of the New York edition with the headline: The Empty Promise of Tax Incentives.. EmailShare728 Comments
.AllReader PicksNYT PicksNYT Replies.NewestComments Closed
yogeshsaxenaAllahabad ( PRAYAG)..Unselfishness is more paying to the people,
If they have passions to practice self restrain,
All activities of man requires self résistance,
To resist not evil nor hate people any more;
Spiritual knowledge destroys miseries,
Bestow thy modesty through learning,
All actions are your Karma to achieve,
The knowledge gives different picture;
Neither pleasure nor pain passes in soul,
Good and evil are the two phases of coin,
By manifestation of the will of thy man,
As unity in variety is plan of the nature.
Dec. 15, 2012 at 5:14 p.m…K CameronPortland, Oregon..Ms. Story,

Thank you for shining a bright light on a very dark facet of corporate welfare. It is clear that American taxpayers are getting the sucker punch; perhaps a knockout punch. I have a question about what you deemed to be incentives. Here in Portland we have an extensive light rail system with scores of stations throughout the metropolitan area. As a fixed linear system which cannot respond to changing demographics, light rail must try to artificially stimulate supporting development. Therefore, the City of Portland provides incentives for “TOD” (transit-oriented development) projects around light rail stations through a property tax exemption program. To understand what TOD is, think high density residential with some retail on the ground level. If a developer in Portland builds a TOD within a quarter-mile of a light rail station, they pay no property tax for ten years after construction. Ten years of complete property tax exemption, despite the additional number of people and businesses which must necessarily receive public services. That aggregates into millions of foregone property tax dollars which, for an entire decade, do not support public services. I’ve examined the interactive data portion of your otherwise excellent article and I cannot find any indication that such TOD subsidies supporting development corporations were included. If you can please clarify whether that oversight was a conscious decision, and why, I’d appreciate it. Thank you again!
Dec. 14, 2012 at 8:03 a.m.
..mrsdebdavScarsdale..Is there a list of 2012 (and, if available 2013) subsidies paid/to be paid to individual companies by the Federal government? How do I find out how much federal subsidy an individual company receives? This info does not seem readily available. Does a FOIA have to be requested for this?
Dec. 11, 2012 at 7:35 p.m.
..DCVetteDC..I am a Corporate Site Selection Consultant with 30 years of experience and have led over 200 site selection projects – so I know a lot about Incentives. What is remarkable to most of us in this business regarding your Incentives article is that despite being very detailed, you only tell one side of the story.

Decades ago some Economic Development entities got their fingers burned badly by giving Incentives for deals that never materialized and consequently had no recourse – such as the VW plant that never happened in WV.

Lessons learned. In today’s world, anybody who knows about Incentives knows the word “Clawback”.

My question to you – why did you decides to not mention or explain the use of Clawbacks – a very important aspect of Incentive negotiations – in your article? We would really like to know the reason.
Dec. 10, 2012 at 12:12 p.m.Recommended1
..DavidLeePineville, LA..Great writing!! You said there is very little economic data to track the actual benefits these companies produce to local/state economies, but is there any serious data on the matter at all?? You also mention the Minnesota mathmetician’s game theory work on the matter, I would be curious to see some of that data or at least be able to understand what is actually happening on the other side of the argument. I agree that the vast amount of this money spent probably has a very low rate of return economically speaking, but is there any indication at all as to what such a ratio would look like?

Once again, great reporting!
Dec. 10, 2012 at 8:03 a.m.
..BenCascades, Oregon..I wish the Times would cover the public schools CAP loans story recently on NPR. Public school districts all over the nation are taking out insane payday like loans they will never be able to repay.
Dec. 9, 2012 at 1:36 p.m.
..BenCascades, Oregon..Where is the outrage? How many of us will write our mayor, governor, state house member, local paper, and why was this not screamed from the roof tops across America, as it puts the lie to the ocean of fiscal conservative hogwash, tax reform hypocrites, and the one percent trough masters whose lies we have to listen to every day as they receive fair and balance treatment from the most of the news media most of the time.

Thank you Liz Story and New York Times,

This is what I want and expect from the New York Times news organization.
Dec. 9, 2012 at 1:36 p.m.
..caPortland, Oregon..Thank you for a terrific, desperately needed report. I really don’t believe most Americans realize to what extent their resources are being siphoned away by bloodthirsty corporations. Perhaps we should use these billions to instead fund more business competition so these corporations can’t blackmail governments and by extension, taxpayers, into agreeing to such egregious terms. The idea that a business which kills it’s host environment or is like a deadly parasite on the comunity is disgusting. Fair profits? Yes. Rapacious greed? No.
Dec. 8, 2012 at 11:42 a.m.
..Eben FodorEugene, OR..It’s great to see good coverage of this topic. These government expenditures have been intended to induce local growth, which is thought to promote local prosperity. A research study I conducted (published recently) found that growth in US metro areas is not associated with higher employment, higher incomes, or lower poverty. In fact that opposite was found. Residents of slower-growing metro areas made $8,500 more per year per capita than those in the faster growing areas.

Here’s a citation and link to the study:

Relationship Between Growth and Prosperity in the 100 Largest U.S. Metropolitan Areas, by Eben Fodor, Economic Development Quarterly, Volume 26, Issue 3, August 2012, p. 220 – 230. Available here: http://edq.sagepub.com/content/26/3/220
Dec. 8, 2012 at 11:42 a.m.
..RichardDuluth, MN..Important story. On June 24, 2011 the Secretary of Commerce for Indiana wrote a letter to the NY Times replying to a Times story questioning how things were going in Indiana. The letter mentioned a deal where Indiana “recently welcomed another 500 jobs to Indiana from Michigan.” Do you know if this deal involved incentives? I looked at your data base for Indiana, but not knowing what deal was being referred to in the letter, I couldn’t answer my question there. Any chance you know?
Dec. 8, 2012 at 11:42 a.m.
..Mary ZMichigan..Doug Winters has been a crusader for Ypsilanti and Michigan for years. Thank you for this well written article, which I know took over a year to write.

What a perfect quote:

“We’re their own private ATM. When they need money, they come begging, but when they don’t want oversight, they say ‘get out of the way.’”

Doug Winters, attorney for Ypsilanti Township, Mich.
Dec. 8, 2012 at 11:42 a.m.
..Mark FunkhouserWashington..Thanks for doing this work. As former City Auditor and Mayor of Kansas City, Missouri I spent a lot of time on this issue. Your points are right on target.
Dec. 8, 2012 at 11:42 a.m.
..JKIndiana..The most telling line in this story? “Questioned about incentives, officials at dozens of other large corporations said they owed it to shareholders to maximize profits”.

Until this perverse, extreme notion of doing business is curtailed, we can expect nothing better than the mess we’re mired in.
Dec. 8, 2012 at 11:42 a.m.
..G.C. JohnsonTexas..Hi Louise,
If you haven’t already, perhaps you could take a look at Rick Perry’s corporate welfare project aka the Texas Enterprise Fund. It’s been a money machine for our sitting Gov’s campaign coffers for a few years now.
Dec. 8, 2012 at 11:42 a.m.
..Katie PaineBerlin NH..My hats are off to you. As a former reporter and the daughter of a former Managing Editor and Publisher of Fortune I have to congratulate you. this is an amazing piece of work. I have a question on how the data was compiled for the database. My company, KDPaine & Partners, is listed as receiving “free services’ but in fact we received a matching training grant. We paid half and the state paid half of the tuition to send my students to the local community college and to online courses to increase their skill level. Did the state call it “free services” or was that a category that you created?
I’d like to think that we put it to good use. I am happy to say that several of those employees are now running the Berlin office and we have continued to invest in and grow in New Hampshire.
Dec. 6, 2012 at 12:10 p.m.
..tlbdetroit, mi..This is a very important piece and should not be a one-off deal. I hope you are able to keep the issue alive by further mining the data you’ve assembled to create a series of front page stories. Corporate coercion, executive greed, community desperation, and a complete lack of federal oversight (or less benignly–collusion) are all part of the witch’s brew that characterizes the past several decades, leaving us in the sorry state we find ourselves in today. If you can’t legislate morality, at least Congress could legislate restraints on bad behavior.
Dec. 6, 2012 at 11:13 a.m.
..TeryToronto..That is a shame. the oil industry does not really need incentive, they are already save so much money with the tax exemption they got from the Bush era and they always transfer so much money in those many fiscal heaven.



Dec. 6, 2012 at 1:43 a.m.
..lawTechOakland, CA..Great story. I’ve personally watched over the last 5 years as a new investigative initiative, “CopLink” was launched and adopted by Federal, State, and Local law enforcement agencies, watched as millions of taxpayer dollars were poured into the effort, and deals were struck among agencies. And now? Coplink is now owned by IBM and being sold as an IBM product! What happened? How could all of that public money gone into something that would just end up being a profit center for IBM? I’m disgusted. Why should IBM ultimately profit from such large scale public funding? Would all of that money have been poured into the effort if it had been stated at the beginning what the final outcome was going to be?
Dec. 5, 2012 at 11:09 p.m.
..Curmudgeon KilljoyDallas, TX..Mark M, this free market proponent is a an opponent of tax incentives and subsidies. Each is the economic equivalent of the other.

When you hear politicians and business people talking about public-private partnerships, some taxpayer is about to get fleeced, and some politician is about ready to take that taxpayer’s money and put it into the pocket of a future campaign contributor.
Dec. 5, 2012 at 9:22 p.m.Recommended1
..MarkKansas City..Just as often they extract wealth. Capitalism works because someone somewhere gets less then they should. Or even worse it’s stolen outright from them. Otherwise, there would be no wealth to move to the top.
Dec. 5, 2012 at 6:17 p.m.
..MarkKansas City, Missouri..Gov. Brownback appears to lament the status quo but truly enjoys the game and has taken the initiative. Non-Kansas merchants beware. His strategy includes eliminating or reducing state sales tax. Self detrimentally, people will drive across that state line to avoid sales taxes needed in their community. A zero sum game? Unfortunately Kansas is putting others on the negative side of the equation.

Because in fact this is a means of not only reducing Kansans’ own state government but also forcing their neighbors to do so by forcing a reduction in collected revenue in an attempt to compete. If your state, county or city has any economic disadvantage such as infrastructure needs, lower per capita income or a disproportionate number of poor you cannot compete. The rich get richer, you’re on your own. Even worse, if you can’t compete, you lose. If you do compete, you lose. Live and let live?

Oddly, people enraged over Solyndra are completely blind to their hypocracy when they allow these handouts to other businesses. I guess it’s alright as long as they come out on top.

Like it or not, those are Americans on the other side of that invisible state line. To declare economic war on your neighbors and hide behind states rights would be defined as what type of behavior exactly? The answer to that question depends on whether you embrace conservative economic ideology, business ethics and the Ayn Rand ethos, or, you are human.

This needs to end nationally. There is no half measure.
Dec. 5, 2012 at 6:17 p.m.Recommended1
..JanetJacksonville, Fl..What’s really scary here is the multiple levels of “incentives”. At the local level, developers will be incented to develop residential and commercial projects by not requiring them to pick up the infrastructure costs in impact fees. The elected officials either do not charge them or “waive” them to create jobs. Very much the same theme as in this article at the corporate employer level. So taxpayers absorb the costs or endure eroded roads, education systems–see these infrastructure costs are depicted on www.PriceOfSprawl.com for Florida communities.

Louise Story, thanks for a great article and great interactive map of incentives. Please tell the story at the local development level.
Dec. 5, 2012 at 6:17 p.m.
..econobikerSouthern USA..David Cay Johnston wrote about this articles subject in his book Free Lunch: How the Wealthiest Americans Enrich Themselves at Government Expense (and StickYou with the Bill)
Dec. 5, 2012 at 12:22 p.m.Recommended2
..TomFort Wayne, IN..We think something must and can be done. Our Central Labor Council has been representing unemployed and anxiously employed workers in NE Indiana for four years. We have been painfully aware of economic development fraud for quite sometime. We are compelled to represent the interests of workers and real taxpayers. Economic development creates press releases, profits and imaginary jobs while diminishing public services and wage standards. The representational voice and power of the unemployed and anxiously employed has challenged local and state government services and policies. Our most significant work has been our systematic audit of local tax abatements. We compare the promises in the statement of benefits application with the applicants self-reported compliance. Then we look for and frequently find workers at the abated operations who share their stories and pay stubs with us. In public meetings we challenge state, county, and municipal governments with disconcerting reality. Now we are engaged in public dialog with local legislators over significant policy changes. We are deadly serious in our belief that, while very difficult, it may be possible to change the economic development culture to serve workers and real taxpayers.The initiative will not come from smart people in smart suits but it will and is beginning to come from workers and local citizens organizing to represent themselves to bargain in the political economy.
Dec. 4, 2012 at 10:21 p.m.
..KimMChicago..*Thank you* Louise Story for this excellent series. It demonstrates again the need for professional journalists and media outlets that take their role in democracy seriously.
Dec. 4, 2012 at 9:22 p.m.
..Read More Comments
.Verified Commenters enjoy the privilege of commenting on articles and blog posts without moderation.
Verified Commenter FAQ

Report Inappropriate Comment.Vulgar.Inflammatory.Personal Attack.Spam.Off-topic..SubmitCancel.
Add or Edit Your Photo.ApplyMaximum size: 700kb (JPG, PNG, GIF)Your image must comply with our Member Agreement. By clicking save, you certify that we have the right to modify and distribute this image..Or, Edit Your Full Profile.


The carve-up of Detroit [VKD. Brought about by William J. Clinton [ARKANSAS] offering TAX RELIEF AND NEW PLANTS IF AUTO INDUSTRY MOVED TO ARKANSAS]


The carve-up of Detroit
23 October 2014
Detroit, the former auto capital of the world, is in the final stages of a bankruptcy process that has from the start been a conspiracy of the banks against the city’s working class population. Closing arguments in federal bankruptcy court are scheduled to begin next week, a legal formality before the city’s brutal restructuring plan is approved by the judge.

The so-called “Plan of Adjustment” will gut the pensions and health benefits of more than 30,000 current and retired city workers, sanction the sell-off of public assets, and provide a legal fig leaf for the termination of water and other vital services to entire working class neighborhoods.

Last week, some 200 investment bankers from throughout the US gathered at the Center for Venture Capital and Private Equity Finance at the University of Michigan to discuss the business opportunities emerging from the carve-up of Detroit.

The keynote speakers at the Michigan Private Equity Conference included Kevyn Orr, the Jones Day bankruptcy lawyer who was installed 19 months ago as the city’s unelected emergency manager to head up a de facto bankers’ dictatorship. Also speaking was Kenneth Buckfire, former senior vice president of Lehman Brothers and co-founder of New York-based investment firm Miller Buckfire.

Both were key players in the plot to throw Detroit into bankruptcy and set a nationwide precedent for overriding state constitutions (such as Michigan’s) guaranteeing the pension benefits of municipal workers. Orr has paid Buckfire’s firm $8 million to “advise” the city during the bankruptcy.

After a lavish dinner reception, the wealthy investors at the conference were treated to a menu of a different sort. The city of Detroit, Orr and Buckfire told them, was up for grabs.

Among the profit-making opportunities the two listed were “low acquisition costs for real estate and companies” and availability of “44,000 land parcels for redevelopment.” The city’s proximity to the Great Lakes would provide access to fresh water, which would prove crucial to businesses as America’s Southwest dried up, Buckfire noted.

Prospects “appear greater than I’ve seen in Miami, New York and Washington, DC,” Orr enthused. Both men pointed to the city’s recent deal with Wall Street bond insurer Finance Guaranty Insurance Co. (FGIC) to reassure any hesitant investors.

To settle its debt claim, FGIC was given $161 million in credits and other payments and 8.6 acres of choice downtown property along the Detroit River. The city-owned Joe Louis Arena, which sits on this land, will be torn down at taxpayer expense so FGIC can develop upscale housing and a hotel, retail and convention center complex that promises to provide it with many millions in revenue for years to come.

The FGIC payout exceeded a previous deal with bond insurer Syncora, which was handed half of the Detroit-Windsor Tunnel, millions in cash and credits, and several city-owned parking garages. The bond insurers were paid off to cover the claims of major Wall Street banks, which entangled the city in disastrous financial schemes widely acknowledged to have been illegal.

Having created the catastrophe in Detroit by dismantling the city’s auto manufacturing base, while extorting billions in tax breaks and abatements, the financial mafia is exploiting the crisis of its own making to impoverish the city’s workers and make itself even richer.

Under the restructuring plan, spending on the city’s long-neglected social services will be limited to $140 million a year. A state-appointed financial oversight committee will have the power to reject new borrowings or “profligate” spending—all for the benefit of the city’s bondholders. The deep cuts in pensions and elimination of health care payments to retired city workers, along with the downsizing of the city, will ensure that an even larger share of city revenue flows to Wall Street.

Buckfire—who owns several multi-million-dollar homes on New York’s Park Avenue and in the wealthy enclave of Greenwich, Connecticut—told the conference that there “were no excuses left” for Detroit residents not to pay their bills.

This shameless looting gives new meaning to the term “vulture capitalism.” It epitomizes the greed and avarice of the financial aristocracy and its contempt for the welfare of the vast majority of the American people.

The bankruptcy of Detroit has received the full backing of every institution of the political establishment—the courts, the Democrats and Republicans, the Obama administration, the media, the “civil rights” organizations and the trade unions.

Far from opposing the attacks on the working class, the United Auto Workers, the American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees (AFSCME) and the other unions are backing the bankruptcy. They seek only their own cut of the spoils.

Alongside representatives of Blackstone and Credit Suisse at last week’s Michigan Private Equity Conference was Brian Gimotty, a representative of the United Auto Workers’ retiree medical benefits trust—a $55 billion investment fund for the businessmen who run the UAW.

The events in Detroit are vindication of the warnings made by the World Socialist Web Site. In a July 20, 2013 Perspective column, we wrote:

“Just as Greece became the model for attacks on workers throughout Europe and beyond, the Detroit bankruptcy—which goes beyond even the brutal measures carried out in Greece—will set the pattern for the next stage in the attack on the working class in the US and internationally. At stake is every gain won by the working class through immense and often bloody struggle and sacrifice in the course of more than a century.”

The only political force opposing this attack is the Socialist Equality Party. In opposition to the fake-left organizations tied to the Democratic Party and the trade unions, the SEP has insisted that workers should place no faith in the bankruptcy court or any other institution of the capitalist state. The SEP alone fights for the independent mobilization of the working class against the bankruptcy conspiracy.

The struggle to defend the most basic social rights of workers and young people requires the building of a mass political movement of the working class to overturn the capitalist economic and political order. The banks and major corporations must be taken out of private hands and placed under the ownership and democratic control of the working class. The debts owed to the Wall Street parasites must be repudiated and the fortunes obtained through fraud and attacks on jobs and living standards confiscated and applied toward the rebuilding of Detroit and cities across the country.

Jerry White

Share this article


LMAO… Crooked Cook County, Il Blames Cross Vote Error On “Calibration”

The Rumor Mill News Reading Room 

LMAO… Crooked Cook County, Il Blames Cross Vote Error On “Calibration”
Posted By: Watchman
Date: Wednesday, 22-Oct-2014 21:24:18

These silly bastards are too damned ignorant to even cheat.
Oh well.. Things may just work out anyway..
CHICAGO — Early voting in Illinois got off to a rocky start Monday, as votes being cast for Republican candidates were transformed into votes for Democrats.
Republican state representative candidate Jim Moynihan went to vote Monday at the Schaumburg Public Library.
“I tried to cast a vote for myself and instead it cast the vote for my opponent,” Moynihan said. “You could imagine my surprise as the same thing happened with a number of races when I tried to vote for a Republican and the machine registered a vote for a Democrat.”
The conservative website Illinois Review reported that “While using a touch screen voting machine in Schaumburg, Moynihan voted for several races on the ballot, only to find that whenever he voted for a Republican candidate, the machine registered the vote for a Democrat in the same race. He notified the election judge at his polling place and demonstrated that it continued to cast a vote for the opposing candidate’s party. Moynihan was eventually allowed to vote for Republican candidates, including his own race.
Moynihan offered this gracious lesson to his followers on Twitter: “Be careful when you vote in Illinois. Make sure you take the time to check your votes before submitting.”
Cook County Board of Elections Deputy Communications Director Jim Scalzitti, told Illinois Watchdog, the machine was taken out of service and tested.
“This was a calibration error of the touch-screen on the machine,” Scalzitti said. “When Mr. Moynihan used the touch-screen, it improperly assigned his votes due to improper calibration.”


VIDEO-Ole Dammegard: Ebola “news” is psyops. CDC is a CIA proprietary corp. Bilderbergers operationalized JFK assassinat

The Rumor Mill News Reading Room 

VIDEO-Ole Dammegard: Ebola “news” is psyops. CDC is a CIA proprietary corp. Bilderbergers operationalized JFK assassinat
Posted By: Lymerick
Date: Thursday, 23-Oct-2014 03:51:35


VIDEO-Ole Dammegard: Ebola “news” is psyops. CDC is a CIA proprietary corp. Bilderbergers operationalized JFK assassination, 9/11 & EbolaGate
VANCOUVER, BC – In this ExopoliticsTV interview with Alfred Lambremont Webre, author and researcher Ole Dammegard details how Ebola “news” stories are largely disinformation psyops; The CDC Centers for Disease Control is actually a listed CIA proprietary corporation, a front for CIA bio-terror operations; and the Bilderberger organization operationalized large scale false flag operations including the JFK assassination of November 22, 1963, the 9/11 False flag of September 11, 2001, and the EbolaGate Bioweapons martial law false flag operation, operationally coordinated at the 2014 Bilderberger meeting in Stockholm.
CDC and CIA: A Close and Sick Relationship
Ole Dammegard: 2014 Bilderberger venue vulnerable to false flag blamed on Truth movement
Ole Dammegard: Satanic Pentagram part of 9/11-type false flag at 2014 Bilderberger foiled by Truth movement media
IMPORTANT! Exclusive: Ebola – Lies Your Media Told You, by: Brett Redmayne-Titley



Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2014 2:50 PM
Subject: wildduck






Jim Stone ~ Anonymous Doctor Releases Treatment For The Ebola Virus (Not Colloidal Silver)

The Rumor Mill News Reading Room 

Jim Stone ~ Anonymous Doctor Releases Treatment For The Ebola Virus (Not Colloidal Silver)
Posted By: Lymerick
Date: Thursday, 23-Oct-2014 04:26:54

Jim Stone ~ Anonymous Doctor Releases Treatment For The Ebola Virus (Not Colloidal Silver)
“The treatment for Ebola, along with accompanying MOA (Method Of Action) has been sent to this web site.” J Stone
Jim Stone, August 1, 2014 ~ This is a lengthy article, Do not surface read. The actual treatment for ebola which will virtually eliminate fatalities, as revealed by a doctor who has worked with ebola, is below.
Consider this: The elite would never release a plague without an easy cure, and along with this ebola outbreak an American biowarfare firm has been working in Sierra Leon for the last five years. Google that. Sierra Leon has actually identified them as the perpetrators of this outbreak and kicked them out of the country. There is absolutely no doubt this outbreak was intentionally caused by the U.S. war department.
And if it is intentional, a cure is known. There would simply be no other way to do business.
Here is the treatment, complete with MOA. This is a treatment and not a cure, your immune system wipes out the virus, and the treatment gives your immune system time to do it. Here is what Ebola does that is fatal: It causes the complete removal of all vitamin C from the body. No one actually knows what mechanism is involved in doing this, other than a malfunction that is not permanently destructive to whatever is triggered to remove all vitamin C. All the researchers know is that vitamin C drops to zero and all the symptoms of ebola are consistent with a complete loss of vitamin C.
How do I know this? A doctor who has remained anonymous and has worked with ebola victims has discovered this and sent it to this web site, at last check this cannot be googled which confirms this doctor did not just copy paste, So post it everywhere; get this out there, the treatment for ebola which will prevent death is known and this is an emergency request for my readers to spread this info and stop this ebola attack in its tracks.
From an anonymous doctor
“The very first symptoms of ebola are exactly the same as scurvy, which is caused by inadequate vitamin C. Though scurvy is seldom fatal as a primary condition, scurvy also represents only a partial deficiency of vitamin C, the body still has a LOT of vitamin C compared to zero, which ebola causes. Absent ANY vitamin C, blood vessels become very weak and start to lose blood, and platelets become ineffective and unable to trigger clots. So death by ebola is caused by massive internal bleeding and loss of blood, which can be stopped simply by taking enormous doses of vitamin C until the immune system succeeds in killing off the virus.”
Begin text
Ebola is probably the best known of a class of viruses known as hemorrhagic fever viruses. In fact, Ebola virus was initially recognized in 1976. Other less known but related viral syndromes include yellow fever, dengue hemorrhagic fever, Rift Valley fever, Crimean-Congo hemorrhagic fever, Kyasanur Forest disease, Omsk hemorrhagic fever, hemorrhagic fever with renal syndrome, Hantavirus pulmonary syndrome, Venezuelan hemorrhagic fever, Brazilian hemorrhagic fever, Argentine hemorrhagic fever, Bolivian hemorrhagic fever, and Lassa fever. The Ebola virus infection, also known as African hemorrhagic fever, has the distinction of having the highest case-fatality rate of the viral infections noted above, ranging from 53% to 88%.
These viral hemorrhagic fever syndromes share certain clinical features. The Cecil Textbook of Medicine notes that these diseases are characterized by capillary fragility, which translates to easy bleeding, that can frequently lead to severe shock and death. These diseases also tend to consume and/or destroy the platelets, which play an integral role in blood clotting. The clinical presentation of these viral diseases is similar to scurvy, which is also characterized by capillary fragility and a tendency to bleed easily. Characteristic skin lesions develop, which are actually multiple tiny areas of bleeding into the skin that surround the hair follicles. some cases even include bleeding into already healed scars.
In the classic form of scurvy that evolves very slowly from the gradual depletion of vitamin C body stores, the immune system will be sufficiently compromised for infection to claim the patient’s life before the extensive hemorrhage that occurs after all vitamin C stores have been completely exhausted. Ebola virus and the other viral hemorrhagic fevers are much more likely to cause hemorrhaging before any other fatal infection has a chance to become established. This is because the virus so rapidly and totally metabolizes and consumes all available vitamin C in the bodies of the victims that an advanced stage of scurvy is literally produced after only a few days of the disease.
The scurvy is so complete that the blood vessels generally cannot keep from hemorrhaging long enough to allow an infective complication to develop. Also, the viral hemorrhagic fevers typically only take hold and reach epidemic proportions in those populations that would already be expected to have low body stores of vitamin C, such as is found in many of the severely malnourished Africans. In such individuals, an infecting hemorrhagic virus will often wipe out any remaining vitamin C stores before the immune systems can get the upper hand and initiate recovery. When the vitamin C stores are rapidly depleted by large infecting doses of an aggressive virus, the immune system gets similarly depleted and compromised. However, this point is largely academic after hemorrhaging throughout the body has begun.
To date, no viral infection has been demonstrated to be resistant to the proper dosing of vitamin C as classically demonstrated by Klenner. However, not all viruses have been treated with Klenner-sized vitamin C doses, or at least the results have not been published. Ebola viral infection and the other acute viral hemorrhagic fevers appear to be diseases that fall into this category. Because of the seemingly exceptional ability of these viruses to rapidly deplete vitamin C stores, even larger doses of vitamin C would likely be required in order to effectively reverse and eventually cure infections caused by these viruses.
Cathcart (1981), who introduced the concept of bowel tolerance to vitamin C discussed earlier, hypothesized that Ebola and the other acute viral hemorrhagic fevers may well require 500,000 mg of vitamin C daily to reach bowel tolerance! Whether this estimate is accurate, it seems clear as evidenced by the scurvy-like clinical manifestations of these infections that vitamin C dosing must be vigorous and given in extremely high doses. If the disease seems to be winning, then even more vitamin C should be given until symptoms begin to lessen. Obviously, these are viral diseases that would absolutely require high doses of vitamin C intravenously as the initial therapy. The oral administration should begin simultaneously, but the intravenous route should not be abandoned until the clinical response is complete. Death occurs too quickly with the hemorrhagic fevers to be conservative when dosing the vitamin C. (from Vitamin C, Infectious Diseases, and Toxins:Curing the Incurable by Thomas E. Levy MD JD)
Jim Stone’s Comment
I may not be a doctor, but I am awful good with medical topics, and this rings 100 percent true, IT IS THE MOA which if combined with some of my medical knowledge, such as the fact that Broccoli is absolutely excellent for assisting the clotting of blood, that the active component of Noni (which is in pineapple juice) is strongly anti viral, and that cures such as colloidal silver, while good for bacterial infections does nothing for viruses, combine some real knowledge with what this doctor says and it is highly probable that Ebola can be shrugged off as a mild case of scurvy.
Beware the current Colloidal Silver psy op, the actual cure for Ebola has been given to this web site.
Colloidal silver is great stuff, and I have made gallons from a 1 ounce silver bar myself. It works great for curing bacterial infections and making water safe to drink without the nasty taste of iodine. However, colloidal silver will do nothing against viruses, and huge lies are being hatched right now to misguide people to a false ebola cure and the alternative media is lapping it up
All curative agents have a mode of action, or MOA. And if anyone posting medical cures does not know the MOA, they have no idea what they are talking about. Colloidal silver has an MOA that has been known for many decades, yet recently Google has been rigged to bury it with only articles stating “the MOA is being explored and we think it is ___(then disinfo)” and there has to be a reason why this is being done right now, at this point in time with Ebola running amok.
Here is how colloidal silver actually works (its MOA), with first an example: Colloidal silver is to bacteria what cyanide is for all red blooded organisms. In red blooded organisms, cyanide binds with hemoglobin in place of oxygen, and makes it impossible for blood to carry oxygen. With enough cyanide, oxygen starvation via cyanide bonded hemoglobin causes death.
Colloidal silver does the same for bacteria, it binds with the oxygen carriers in bacteria permanently, causing bacteria to quickly die from oxygen starvation. This is the MOA for colloidal silver, which has been clearly known practically forever.
Viruses have no metabolic processes which require an oxygen carrier, and therefore colloidal silver will be completely ineffective against ebola.
Do not let the misinformed in the alternative media fool you by saying colloidal silver is effective against viruses in any way, colloidal silver is only useful for treating secondary bacterial infections that move in after a preceeding viral infection and in the case of ebola, there is not enough time for that to make a difference.
It is extremely important to note that a huge psy op is underway to fake colloidal silver as a cure for viruses and there has to be a reason. Do not fall for it.
SF Source JimStone August 1 2014
Share this:


POOFness Mid-Week Update 10/22/14

Rumor Mill News Agents Forum
POOFness Mid-Week Update 10/22/14
Posted By: Mr.Ed [Send E-Mail]
Date: Wednesday, 22-Oct-2014 21:41:00

——– Original Message ——–
From: 2goforth
To: 2goforth
Subject: Mid Week Report
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2014 21:26:42 -0400
October 22, 2014
Copyright ZAP 2014
Donations are needed to keep the lights on and the news coming. Please go to Paypal.com…account to donate to is goneforthfornow@gmail.com, if you have a problem please contact us at 2goforth@safe-mail.net. Thank you and Blessings, Susan
Love and Kisses,
Susan and Staff

HOA taking of property rights can be a constitutional violation, by George Staropoli, HOA Constitutional Government

This Florida appellate case, Duvall v. Fair Lane Acres, Inci, has important ramifications for the loss of property rights that are taken away by private entity homeowners associations. The court he…


Bits and Pieces Late Wednesday Night

Bits and Pieces Late Wednesday Night

Emailed to Recaps:

[Arthur] The so-called Balassa-Samuelson effect (BS) is an economic hypothesis that implies that countries with rapidly expanding economies should tend to have more rapidly appreciating exchange rates which is common sense any 4 year old child should realize will naturally occur with Iraq’s ongoing economic and political reform progression as it would any other emerging economy…. But has less than zero to do with the revaluation process of the Iraqi Dinar.

 To believe it did implies a total misunderstanding of the history of the IQD.

In 1959 the IQD was pegged to the USD at the rate of 1 dinar= 2.8 dollars, and settled at US$3.22 where it remained until the Gulf War.

The current rate of 1166 is not the economic reality rate of Iraq, but is a post Sadaam era “program rate” used by the IMF after UN sanctions were imposed to monitor Iraq’s rebuilding efforts and therefore was not caused or engendered by the economic reality or potential of the Iraqi economic outlook.

So therefore just as there was no reverse Balaasa-Samuelson effect that caused a gradual decrease of the IQD exchange rate, but was engendered by a sudden action caused by the worsening political and economic reality of the Gulf War era, so we can expect a similar reverse action based on the current political and economic reality within Iraq.

We are now awaiting the final sovereignty to be granted internationally based on the efficiency of the newly formed, fully inclusive GOI to ratify, open and fully implement a nationwide budget which will abruptly usher the new revalued IQD on to the global scene.



R.V. / GCR October 22, 2014


Omega Man > TRNS are live…I don care wut nobody sayz

Carden > Omega Man And they’ve been “live” for a long while now.


More Guesses to NEW Picture Intel/Clues

Vinman October 22, 2014

Dong is busting out.

Watch the next 72 hrs.

Zim is a coin toss and is up in the air.


Beverly October 22, 2014 at 8:20pm

Here is my take on EXO’s clues for today.

At 7:00 the Dragon’s are PHONING(Red Phone) the World Bank.

Banksters want 3 different rates simultaneously. CAUGHT with their hand in the cookie jarBank of England!

The DEBT burden for countries around the world is too heavy.

The BLACK phone is ringing……and the sociopath’sare MAD!

Vietnamese Dong (100,000 shown) we are WATCHINGfor it to BUST OUT! It is NEXT!

The ZIMBABWE (100,000,000,000 shown) is still a coin toss and up in the air.

SNOWING and beautiful weather for gifts.

Dinar Updates:

Poppy3 :  the new RATE is very possible this week!

Several events that can trigger their actions to raise the rate for sure…NEW YEAR, ISX GOING ONLINE, ANNOUNCEMENTS, ISIS UNDER CONTROL.




[natok] hijack in forum… I just received a call from a friend who deals with traders and he said his friend who does bonds said via a 3 page email what Tony & DC have been saying that in Iraq everything was done(everyone seated, in gazette, Govt ready to go to do business). This friend of mine doesn’t get on dinar calls, but he knows that I do.

[pappabear] I have a short bank story. Just got back from wells Fargo bank in Florida and I opened a checking account.and then asked the lady where is the closest currency exchange with WF and she said we can do it she asked what currency do you have. I said I don’t know if I should ask. She said Iraq dinar I said yes. She said we know about it also spoke about the 800# and then call her and more was said in about a 30 min conversation.



“SHOCKING” Interview with Super Soldier “Rachel” (Video)

Rumor Mill News Agents Forum
“SHOCKING” Interview with Super Soldier “Rachel” (Video)
Posted By: Mr.Ed [Send E-Mail]
Date: Thursday, 23-Oct-2014 04:12:57

“SHOCKING” Interview with Super Soldier “Rachel” (Video)
Bases 25 Part Two SSS Rachel (Black Goo)
Published on Jun 7, 2013
The Super Soldier Summit continues with Super-Soldier “Rachel”, not her real name. She claims to be a test tube baby, manufactured in the underground labs. She is a raw food diet vegetarian, and does not do any form of drug abuse or self harming recreational drugs.
Her telepathic and empathic nature is not dis-similar to the British Sentient Fluid witness Alistair in the Bases 18/ Ammach interviews.
She is Extremely Telepathic. During her remarks about the black goo, she actually accessed parts of my mind during the interview.
Off camera remarks in Part 3, refer to the Diamond Spider Battles in the Arctic, where she repeatedly mentioned how hard it is to kill these giant 12ft Diamond Spiders. Something James Casbolt mentioned in Bases 23.
It was one of these giant Diamond Spiders, I encountered at the rear of SKY NEWS, West London, when it appeared via a “portal” which I had monitored there for 15 years.

She is extremely telepathic, and states clearly she is a survivor of many of the horrors of these bases, where caged children are connected to a system, most of whom die. Her message is that of survival. Injected with the Black Goo, surviving a Shape Shifting Queen Elisabeth II, who she claims became a Draco Raptor, and devours a person strapped on an alter right above her.
Her message has many vital issues and data sets. Note the 3 ridges on her brow. In every respect a sensitive, empathic and beautiful young woman, with an important message, for us all, if we are to survive.
Note these are claims, and that is all.


<iframe width=”640″ height=”360″ src=”//www.youtube.com/embed/ohx7bSeD5bQ?feature=player_detailpage” frameborder=”0″ allowfullscreen></iframe>


Warren Buffett Lost $1 Billion Yesterday, and Another $700 Million Today….Pretty Soon We Will Be Talking Real Money…


Posted By: Watchman
Date: Wednesday, 22-Oct-2014 21:14:15

Poor uncle Warren. He better drink a lot more Coke Classic. He owns 400 million shares of Coke. He lost $1 billion yesterday on his 70 million shares of IBM. What a genius. The doddering old fool doesn’t see the death of consumer spending. He is so rich and disconnected from the real world, despite portraying a folksy uncle, that he hasn’t grasped that the middle class has been gutted by his buddies at the Federal Reserve and on Wall Street. They are the people drinking Coke and eating Big Macs. The average family is so stretched after seeing their real household income not grow since 1989, while their debt load has skyrocketed, they can no longer afford a lousy McDonald’s Happy Meal.

Coke and McDonalds were the poster children for the American consumer society. These are mega-corporations who generated $50 billion and $30 billion in revenues annually. They are in decline. They will not be revived, because the consumer is gutted and dead on the side of the financial superhighway. Keep believing the economic recovery storyline as companies selling stuff to consumers keep reporting shitty results. Only a blithering idiot, Warren Buffett or a CNBC bimbo would believe it.

The rest: http://investmentwatchblog.com/warren-buffett-loses-another-700-million-today/


Report: Obama Administration Released 75% of Illegals Rather than Deport Them


October 22, 2014 in News by Mike Slad

Source: Freedom Outpost
President Barack Obama’s immigration policy has left most illegal immigrants with clean records untouched, only focusing on illegals with criminal records and repeat border violators, a new study shows.

The study, conducted by the Migration Policy Institute (MPI), found that around 95 percent of those deported met the national security requirements Obama stipulated, while only 5 percent, or 77,000, illegal immigrants were deported by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) with no criminal record. MPI tracked the data from 2009 to 2013.

Although President Obama has stated that he will refine deportation procedures later this year, the report states that unless he modifies priorities, there will be no significant increase in deportation. Instead of worksite and random enforcement, the Obama administration has shifted significantly from the previous Bush, meaning that the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) focuses mostly on the border, rather than interior areas. This is to ensure that deportation is more “human,” and for Obama, border enforcement helps to eliminate the climate of fear among already established illegals in the country.

Researchers argued that attempts to render deportation more human and reduce fear have actually lead to increased illegal immigration.

“In effect, the Obama administration has shifted from a more generalized model of enforcement to a model focused almost exclusively on illegal border crossers, obstructionists, and criminals…These policies allow for the exercise of discretion to not deport most people who fall outside these parameters,” the report noted.

Even with priority illegals, however, a recent study from the Center for Immigration Studies showed that in fiscal year 2014, ICE predicted that it would deport only 312,000 immigrants, a sharp drop of 25 percent from the amount ICE said it had funding to deport. In fiscal year 2014, ICE released 442,000 of 585,000 illegals it encountered, amounting to a stunning 75 percent release rate. No attempt was made by the agency to deport them.

ICE shot back, saying that some deportations cost more than others.


“Tonight Mr. Dave Schmidt, on his radio program, will have the person who calls himself the Ambassador …”

The Rumor Mill News Reading Room 

Reader: “Tonight Mr. Dave Schmidt, on his radio program, will have the person who calls himself the Ambassador …”
Posted By: hobie [Send E-Mail]
Date: Wednesday, 22-Oct-2014 18:47:00

(Thanks, A. :)
Reader Anon writes:
Hello Mr. hobie,
Some may not be aware that tonight Mr. Dave Schmidt, on his radio program, will have the person who calls himself the Ambassador of the Dragon Family as his guest. Dave Schmidt claims that he, Schmidt, was watched for a period of time by certain Dragon members before the Ambassador contacted him. This is very similar to what Poof said years ago.
Since the Ambassador announced recently that the Dragon Family has, in essence, taken over the Federal Reserve, it has caused quite an Internet storm. Tonight’s program should be of great interest to many, many thousands.
We have reached a point where it is not safe to walk down the street due to all the spitting contests.
The guy who runs the White Hat Auxiliaries website has let go of a big wad. He says:
“Well, I am not going to call in to ask the “Ambassador” any questions if that is what you mean. I already received some feedback on him from our WH contact, and I cannot repeat it here. LOL
“Are we supposed to believe that this hidden bloodline man’s family came out of hiding after thousands of years, and chose as their path of publicly coming out a seminar speaker who let a New Zealand con job pull a “private dong exchange” on him and his legions?
“I am sorry, but I have my doubts about this. Dave does NOT impress me as a cracker jack judge of people, and I have to also conclude that any legitimate elder family members would not conduct their affairs in so public a fashion.
“I hope I am wrong, and I do not disparage the good will message of hope. But, I am not in a position to be so trusting with granting loyalty or believing something based on a voice and a claim to title.” (dated October 21)
I hope someone asks the Ambassador about Clyde Hood’s Omega and Jim Gilmore’s several programs. Also, questions about the role the group calling themselves The White Hats is playing. Also about Poof and ZAP.
Do I ask too much? Please post. And thank you.


[rod-class] 2 New Private Calls and a VERY Important Document !

- 2 New Private Calls
New Private Calls:
Thurs, 10.16.14:
How The People Were TRICKED Into CONSENT !
http://recordings.talkshoe.com/TC-48361/TS-909263.mp3  33 min
Also, Thurs, 10.16.14:
http://recordings.talkshoe.com/TC-48361/TS-909248.mp3  25 min
>> AND the Very IMPORTANT Document <<
“An Opinion from the U.S. Attorney General in 1867″

on the Reconstruction Acts and their relation to the
U.S. Military…
It is in the following link to the Folder:


HOWEVER, the FIRST File to Read is named:
0_READ_THIS_FIRST…U.S._Attny_Gen_Opinion_of_June_12_1867 !
The “OPINION” follows that File…
And, there are 12 More Files in the Folder !      
The Master Link to the Dropbox Files of Rod Class is:
Choose the DC Gun Case Folder…
>> SAVE ALL BIG LISTS << As there is limited space to put docs, etc.,
and some past info has to be edited out because of the limited space !

Rod Now Needs Your Help With Expenses More Than Ever !
After listening to past Calls and Downloading Documents,
ask yourself:

Did You Just Learn Something ? If so…Why not send a gift ?
Rod has ongoing expenses in getting
HIS filings (and the multiple copies required for the other
parties) off to the court, Including Trips To DC for the Trial ! If you can
help with these expenses as all of us will be the better for it
as more pieces of the judicial and administrative puzzle
are revealed ! Please send what you can…
For Gifts to support AIB info that you >> LEARN on the AIB Calls <<
send to: Rod Class, PO Box 435, High Shoals, NC 28077
Whatever you can send is appreciated !
Thank You !

If you’re NOT on the BIG LIST and got this as a forward –
The Big List (2000+ people and growing) is an alert system
for Rod Class Live Calls, Private Calls AND Documents
and the list goes to people all over the world who are listening and watching –
subscribe by sending an email to:
to be included in these email announcements. The list is automated…

And NOT able to be used as way to contact Rod…


[rod-class] LIVE CALL TONIGHT, Wed 10.22.14, >> 11PM to 1AM << Eastern !

Rod will be INTERVIEWED Tonight, Wed 10.22.14, on the radio show

“The Truth Traveler with Erin Dakin” at >> 11PM << !

…the show is on the Genesis Communications Network (GCN)

The Interview will also be broadcast Live on Rod’s Talkshoe channel at:


Or, Listen at Erin’s Channel via Computer at  http://www.thetruthtraveler.com/

Or, Listen by Phone at:  1- 605-562-7770
To Call the show LIVE with a question or comment:  1-855-660-4261

ALSO…Another Big List will be sent later with info on 2 New Private Calls

and a Very IMPORTANT Document in a New Dropbox File Folder !

>> SAVE ALL BIG LISTS << As there is limited space to put docs, etc.,
and some past info has to be edited out because of the limited space !

Rod Now Needs Your Help With Expenses More Than Ever !
After listening to past Calls and Downloading Documents,
ask yourself:

Did You Just Learn Something ? If so…Why not send a gift ?
Rod has ongoing expenses in getting
HIS filings (and the multiple copies required for the other
parties) off to the court, Including Trips To DC for the Trial ! If you can
help with these expenses as all of us will be the better for it
as more pieces of the judicial and administrative puzzle
are revealed ! Please send what you can…

For Gifts to support AIB info that you >> LEARN on the AIB Calls <<
send to: Rod Class, PO Box 435, High Shoals, NC 28077
Whatever you can send is appreciated !
Thank You !

If you’re NOT on the BIG LIST and got this as a forward
The Big List (2000+ people and growing) is an alert system
for Rod Class Live Calls, Private Calls AND Documents
and the list goes to people all over the world who are listening and watching –
subscribe by sending an email to:
to be included in these email announcements. The list is automated…

And NOT able to be used as way to contact Rod…


Republic to be Proclaimed in Canada, January 1-4, 2015


A Special Communique from The Provisional Council of The Republic of Kanata (Winnipeg)

October 22, 2014


Dear fellow lovers of liberty,

A great awakening is shaking our nation, as more people realize that “Canada” and its criminal sponsors and their laws are null and void. This growing awareness about the need for a Republic of Kanata has swelled our membership to over three hundred men and women in every region of “Canada”. And to accommodate and prepare these members and their delegates, our Council has had to move the date of the Republic’s founding Constitutional Convention in Winnipeg to January 1-4, 2015.

Pre-Convention material will be mailed to all of you before then, including copies of the new draft Proclamation of Independence, and Kanata’s proposed Constitution.

Our new Republic is as strong and real as each of us make it. That’s why local organizing committees for the Republic are active in the five main regions of “Canada”, uniting, educating and mobilizing the people to take back and reclaim their country within the ranks of the Republican movement.

These committees are based in Vancouver, Calgary, Toronto, Montreal and Halifax. If you have not been connected with your local Republic organizers yet, please notify us immediately at republicofkanata@gmail.com . Also watch our website at www.republicofkanata.com .

Our work now focuses on educating people about our vision and principles, and launching direct actions to reclaim our land and its laws. In this regard, a small handbook and youtube posting is being prepared, entitled “Five Ways you Can Build the Republic of Kanata”. These ways include taking the Public Oath to the Republic, issuing Stand Down or Revocation Orders to all “crown” officials, refusing to pay taxes to the criminal state known as Canada, and organizing public Reclamations of so called “crown land” that has been stolen from the people.

As we take back our country and create working alternatives to the collapsing status quo, many more people will join us. The point is to start the process, now.

Monthly updates will follow. Spread the word, and Long live the Republic!

Issued by the Provisional Council for the Republic of Kanata

Colin Sullivan, Secretary

22 October, 2014


*** Iraqi dinar, recently being said *** / TNT Tony’s conference call (long)

The Rumor Mill News Reading Room 

*** Iraqi dinar, recently being said *** / TNT Tony’s conference call (long)
Posted By: hobie [Send E-Mail]
Date: Wednesday, 22-Oct-2014 17:36:56

Hi, Folks -
Found at dinardetectives.com/updates:
10-22-14 TNT DINAR CC (Notes by Adept1):
Replay 805.399.1500, PIN CODE 409029#
Tony: Good morning, TNT! Today is Wednesday, October 22, 2014. We were asked not to do a call on Monday because things were ‘sensitive’. We’ll talk about a whole lot of things before DC gets here!
Everyone who submitted their personal testimonies and letters, we have printed that out tand made some books, and we will pass those along to some folks in Washington DC as a gift from TNT, to let them know what you guys went through. It’s like two bibles stacked up together, once we had it bound – it looks really good. They will be part of history, included with the notes and documents. There is one more thing I want to do, and that is for anyone who actually wrote to politicians, physical letters that were not posted online, we would love to include any responses you received from different politicians. Many cannot scan or copy them, please send them to.
Tony Renfrow, PO Box 9580 Oak Avenue Parkway #7, Folsom CA, 95630.
If you could make a copy and sent it to that PO Box, I can bind them into these books as Section 2. The more responses, the more complete picture we will have. We will post that address on the first page of the TNT website so non-members will have access. Send them to Tony Renfrow, not TNT, okay?
Also, we do have bills to pay – they called me this morning – so anyone who can donate, that would be really helpful. Hopefully this is the last time we have to ask. I was hoping the RV would hit by then. It should have happened last night, the night before, and it should happen tonight!
In Iraq, Parliament met yesterday and today, and everyone anticipated the RV hitting before then so they wouldn’t have to answer to Parliament. Monday we were asked not to do a call, and then I got calls and texts asking why others were saying things and we were not. People make stuff up! Or they take our information and repost it. We have the largest audience and influence on the internet for dinar, and the government knows that. You know that if I’m not doing a call, I have been asked not to do a call – because thignsi were really sensitive and they didn’t want anyone to screw it up. First I was asked to delay the call, and then just postpose it so we wouldn’t have to worry about timing. Everyone was on pins and needles expecting the RV on Monday afternoon. It didn’t happen, because of some other things we talked about. It had nothing to do with ministers, HCL, but other deals being worked in the background that have to do with Iraq, but not the RV. The RV is being held hostage, or being held as a negotiating tool – as are we. The governments are trying to accomplish something – let me tell you a story. I discussed this with some people, and they say I give the government too much credit.
Back when the soldiers were leaving Iraq according to prior administration’s agreement, some said that the President should have negotiated to keep some there. Maybe he should, but maybe there was a different scenario: that Iraq was saying they have total control and they don’t need us. So we listened to Iraq saying it could swim, and we agreed that they need to grow up and do the right things. We left and left the situation in the hands of their PM at that time. Then we saw that he was a bigger crook than we thought, and now that we see Iraq is a sovereign nation, he was turning into a dictator. They wanted us gone, and we left.
The PM did a power grab, taking all the money, and then we had to figure out how to get this knucklehead out that we put in, without getting everyone there mad that we were still controlling their leadership. They have to do it on their own, and we let them create a situation (which they did) and we let it get out of control (which we could have fixed in a minute) until the people themselves said, “Enough is enough – these people have to go”. They have to change their own mindset in order to get this done. (This is only my vision and opinion, what I see has occurred. There is no secret info in all this, no documents.)
So now we are at the point where this would-be dictator has created something that is out of control. He cannot call it back and we are not going to deal with it until they ask us to come back and help. By this time, the government is asking for our help, not just in the air but on the ground. Initially they were told to lay down their arms, but now it has gone over the top, and they are asking the US to come in help on the ground. We have agreed to do that, but only if they do everything the former PM promised in his eight years, but Iraq has to do it in eight weeks – laws, government, ministries, and all. Then the Iraqis will welcome our troops back in because instead of being enemies, we will be helping against a common enemy.
What then? Our own soldiers are on the ground, giving Iraqis peace of mind, removing a common enemy and providing security for Iraq AND all those with this currency and interested in investing in Iraq. This could have been designed that way or it could have just happened that way. But two years ago I said to Pam, “We’re leaving Iraq, but I’ll bet you will be invited back” and now we are. There is air power over Iraq, Turkey is now engaged, and there are other things we will see in the near future. That’s another picture of why and how we are where we are today…
It should have gone on Monday, and Iraq asked for 24-48 hours to finalize some agreements with other countries. It had nothing to do with the RV, but with security, fraud, money-laundering, etc. They wanted to finalize those before this happened, so everyone knows where they stand. Some of what Mtn Goat said was true, but this is more in depth. Others can say certain things that we cannot because “we are the people”; when they were trying to take it all away from us, we had that twitter campaign. Out of respect for the people who rescued that situation, if they ask me NOT to do this or that, or tell that other thing, I comply. This morning I asked, because DC is not here, but he is having phone problems, so if I say too much, they will call me.
This could and should go at any moment. My personal opinion is that it will go on Friday. There is nothing stopping the RV, it’s all these side deals. As soon as those are done, it could go any moment. I just like the weekend plan; it makes sense based on how they want to process us.
On Monday, they started putting out NEW 10,000 and 20,000 dinar notes. They have new designs with new security features, etc. Those OLD notes will go from 10,000 to 10 dinar; the NEW ones will be at the new rates. They issued them so that ISIL won’t have the new rates, and so that people can buy large items (and they don’t believe in credit cards yet). Those who have large cash transactions will have access to these new 10K and 25K notes – not the average citizens. They have to ask for these higher notes until people get used to the Qi cards and seeing numbers on screens rather than cash in hand. These new notes do not affect our currency at all; we will still exchange at new rates, and a 25K note will still be worth 25,000 dinar. Those new notes are for in-country purposes ONLY, so everyone can relax on that issue.
Bank procedures: they have got that worked out and we have been given more information but have been asked not to talk about that until the RV is announced. It is simple, you will really like it, and it will go quickly. The rates are still there, the currencies are there, and they are still projected to come out in a basket together.
318 caller: This is my first time on the call. I have a couple of questions. Do all the dinar/ dong people know that this is about to RV?
Tony: They do not, and the powers don’t want them to.
Caller: You said that we can open a fresh account with the bank we intend to exchange with, and you also told us not to mix the different currencies. So does it matter that we opened an account with cash?
Tony: This is what I would do. Someone from the UST told me we should not mingle the dinar exchange with the other currencies, because dinar is being tracked by the UST and other currencies are tracked by the Fed. I would open an account right now for 25 dollars, and then take out the 25 dollars. Then I would put my money in that empty account. Down the road, I can move that money around, but to start with, use a new account with zero balance. Having that account set up in advance will make the whole transaction so much smoother for you.
Caller: Will you be able to have Okie on the call you make to us?
Tony: I don’t know. I want to give Okie the opportunity to make that RV announcement, because he has been honest and fair and telling people what he knows when he knows it. There are people who don’t want me to do that, but I’ll see if I can get around that. I will also make a tweet and do a call, but they will try to control that situation, so I don’t know.
Caller: I was hoping DC would be here today so I could tell him that I live next door in Louisiana. I’m not going to Texas until this Ebola thing is over. [Tony: It is over.]
303 caller: I put a post in the forum on the 20th entitled “No good deed goes unpunished” and I would like to make sure you read that.
Tony: I did see it. I don’t know who will get the contract rate and who will not. It will be a percentage of the people. I don’t know how they decide who gets it, but I do have people monitoring that, so that the contract rate does get out. You can trust that my NDA started at five pages like everyone else. Then it went to 31 pages, and now it’s 44 pages. I’m agreeing to stuff that is crazy, BUT they are also agreeing to some stuff in exchange. If they don’t live up to their part, I don’t’ have to live up to mine. The people who stood up and made sure that we are included will still be there, and they will make sure the right things are done. I have faith that they will do the right thing, and pray that they will so that I can do the right thing, too.
Caller: Thanks for that and for those who have been covering our backs. Also, when does Iraq stop selling at the old rate?
Tony: In different parts of the country they are still using five different rates, and it’s chaos because no one knows what they are doing until this comes out. It’s crazy, with different prices. CBI is to go before Parliament to explain why they haven’t yet activated the RV, and they do NOT want to say it’s because of some other country’s issue. There are people in the GOI who have been blind to all this, and the CBI really doesn’t want to have to answer certain questions. Having said that, some of these issues are really important to Iraq and its future stability – nothing to do with money.
Caller: I understand and yet we are also investors who want a resolution. I know you are keeping a balance for us and I appreciate that.
828 caller: DC has said several times he is exchanging on two trips for security reasons; how can we do that if we’re only allowed one appointment?
Tony: You have only one first appointment, and of course you’ll have to have another appointment to bring in your reserves. It’s interesting that DC can do that – he’s a little scary, eh? I’m not concerned about security myself because I’m not telling anyone what time or place my appointment is taking place.
Caller: If we get there and don’t like the rate, what do we do then?
Tony: We don’t know yet. I would walk into another bank, tell them what I want to do, they would give me the 800 number for that bank and I’d make another appointment. That is what I would do.
Caller: The first basket – what are they saying now?
Tony: They are saying “several currencies”, but it does keep shifting. They may change it tomorrow and ask, “Why did you say that on the call?” Because you didn’t tell me not to!
719 caller: Where do we stand the dollar:dollar rate? You explained the logic behind that, but where is it now?
Tony: Even if it does RI [rather than RV], the rate is higher than a dollar. The RV pretty much has to be $3.58 or thereabouts. Even if it starts at a dollar, Iraq is being told in the media and mosques that they will be the richest in the region, and Kuwait has just raised their rate. Even if for some reason it came out at a dollar, how many minutes do you think that would last in the market? That is the scenario for the first mouse, and you don’t want to be the first mouse.
Caller: You told us to have a plan if it does come out at a dollar.
Tony: The US is still showing at a dollar, because we are negotiating. Every other country shows it at more than three dollars. So…
Caller: How much longer can this go on? We would love to send you all the money you need for the forum, but people are drained at this point.
Tony: While that is the rate it shows right now, that does not mean it will come out that way. I t doesn’t mean the process itself hasn’t already started, with really good things taking place in the background that are moving us closer and closer. It just means that we need to finalize this part of this before the global explosion. They are doing this like a parent says to a child, “We are doing this for your sake.” There are things in cyberspace that Iraq has no clue about, how it’s been manipulated, how there has been fraud and insider trading. They don’t have experience of that, and they have to understand and be protected from it before this RV hits the streets and the markets. Otherwise, IRAQ could lose hundreds and millions if there are not protective blocks in place before this happens. Otherwise, investors will not feel safe, and Iraq itself will collapse in ten months. The banks have been given a date and time to look for this, and we’ll see if they keep to that. But there are so many things going on behind the scenes.
Caller: So it’s not the US but Iraq trying to shore up what has been done?
Tony: It was the US last week, and now Iraq is taking a little time to understand. Abadi said that over 100 billion dollars is missing from the last eight years, and he said, “We cannot do that again!” So there are people who have to be replaced and other security measures put in place.
Caller: Will we see this before 1. November?
Tony: Yes, I do, and I think it will come out on Friday afternoon or evening. And I don’t think that it will come out dollar:dollar because of some things I know that I cannot tell you. Even if it did come out at a dollar, that wouldn’t last five minutes. The hedge funds would buy up every dinar they could find and their holdings would triple overnight. Hell, I’d do that myself. It just doesn’t make sense.
Caller: Since everyone will have the money at some point, we would all be happy to pay for RayRen’s seminar at any of the four events. I would certainly sit and listen to him – he’s entertaining! I couldn’t go to the Denver one because I couldn’t afford it.
Tony: I think he’s entertaining! I hope we will do the events, and WF will give their class at each of them. Ray says he still wants to hold his events post-RV because that is his passion. So we’ll see.
Caller: How can we give back to TNT if the forum goes down after the RV?
Tony: Fewer than a thousand people have donated to the TNT forum, and after the RV I will be setting up a foundation to help kids, so anyone who wants to donate to that, it would be great!
404 caller [yet again]: Is going to happen this year or next year? [meaning Islamic year]
Everything is place for this to happen right now! Everything has been voted on, all the ministers and deputy ministers are in place, they changed the bank laws, they announced in Iraq that everyone would be on the new rate from 1. October, and today they said they are Article 8 compliant. There is nothing for them to wait for. They have passed out the new notes and the lower denominations from the banks to the fields. They are absolutely trying to get this done right now. The ISIL situation went out of control by the person who brought it in. Now there is a new plan once everyone has met their requirements and agreements. It was supposed to go Monday, they asked for 48 hours, and today is Wednesday. It could go any moment; I just think it will be dragged out until Friday. But the information is scrolling across the bottom of the television right now, so they are keeping their people informed. We’ll see what happens when CBI comes out of Parliament.
Caller: You said that fines were involved – is that actually happening? I mean, have people or institutions been fined, and where does that money end up?
Tony: I am told that they were actually being assessed, but don’t know who was being fined or where that money is going.
Caller: Now that they are issuing those new bills and we have the older variety, does that mean we need to exchange within a 30-day period? Have they gone back to that?
Tony: That was going to be the exchange time for the higher contract rates. For international rates, we were told we’d have up to two years. DC thought perhaps they put that time limit in to encourage people to exchange right away. Over there, with the new notes, they may not care any more because those with the old notes will not get as much for them.
650 caller: [I gave fair warning that I would not listen to or transcribe this guy ever again.]
Tony: Admiral’s group has not exchanged so far as I know. In Iraq, they are trying to get people to exchange the old notes for the lower denominations, but people are waiting until they can get the new rates. In Iraq, there are also coins available, although I don’t have pictures at this point. If you put pictures on the internet, they are tagged and they can track where the pictures were taken. So it’s not safe for those with the pictures.
There are people in this country who have already been paid – both international and contract rates, and rates below international. Some have got 100% of their money and some only 20%. Everyone here will get international rates with no problems. I just got updated bank procedures of how this is going to work, here in the US. They have been trained and they plan on you coming into the banks here to exchange.
609 caller: Don’t they have to make this rate before ISX goes live internationally, right?
Tony: In my opinion only, it will not come in before Friday. And they can make it live without the new rate, it just won’t go internationally posted. The lop is going to happen in-country ONLY, so stop worrying about things that do not affect us.
Caller: What’s the issue with the HCL?
Tony: There is no issue! It was published officially last week! The Kurds wanted 17.75%, Maliki said no, Abadi said 17%, and the Kurds agreed and signed. And now the CBI is front of Parliament like a Congressional committee to explain why the RV has not yet been released. They said today/tomorrow, but I have heard of other things being negotiated on the side that will make it easier and more straightforward if they are done before rather than afterwards.
423 caller: I want to ask about the Kiesha’s Funds – how can I get involved with that, when it’s ready? I have donated a couple of time, and would like to donate through that fund once you get it started…
Tony: I don’t know. I haven’t seen the NDA. It’s ridiculous to even think of an NDA that long. It may not have anything to do with the foundation. I appreciate your wanting to get involved and I was talking with someone last night about making it nationwide. I’d love for it to be like a franchise so anyone can duplicate it to help the kids. My first target is to help kids ‘aged out’ of the system with nowhere to go. Even if we get restricted, I hope it’s just about dinar, and you should be able to Google “Kiesha’s Kids” and find out.
617 caller: Are all banks going to have the contract rates? I read only three…
Tony: All of them should have access to it, even tier 2 banks.
Caller: Can we sign up for the events now, or do we have to register post-RV?
Tony: Once we get clearance, I’ll put it up and people can sign up again.
Caller: I don’t see when everyone cannot donate ten bucks…
Tony: I would appreciate that, but people can only do what they can do. From the start, only a few have carried everyone. I don’t want people to feel pressured, but if people can help, that would be great. Those who don’t have money but who help out on the boards, we all appreciate that as well. That’s what this is about: those who helped with info and supported us through the #wearethepeople campaign and are supporting us still.
Caller: You will send out the information even if it’s the middle of the night, right?
Tony: I still want to call Okie first, if I can, but otherwise I will send out the information just as soon as I get it… through tweets, blasts, calls, whatever means possible. As soon as they say GO, they are ready for people to start calling! Also, I just got a text from someone, and he Googled the new 25,000 dinar, and he texted me a picture. So it is out there for everyone to see.
954 caller: [Appreciation] Your calls are an education for the kids they cannot get in schools! I cannot stall my foreclosure any longer; God willing, this will come in before that date. My hair is almost white over all this!
Tony: You evidently haven’t seen my picture, have you! I hope and pray you get to save your house. I hope it happens this weekend and turns your world around. For those who have lost your house/car, etc., still hold onto your dinar, because that is your lifeline. I hate to hear people have sold their dinar to pay the light bill because then they have no hope for the future. If there is any way, hold onto your dinar and prepare. Sometimes you have to experience the pain to feel the joy.
Caller: I have sold everything else, but not my dinar. It’s never entered my mind because this is what will change my life and my family’s lives. I’ve given dinar to each of my kids and to friends in need. I’m paying it forward, keeping the bare minimum to keep the roof over my head and paying the rest forward and being grateful I can help other people.
417 caller: You said last week that if it came in at a dollar, you would cash in. Then you said that if it came in at $3, you would have to have a lot of courage… explain?
Tony: If it came in at a dollar, I would cash some in to have money in my pocket and then use the rest to triple my money. You know it’s going to be within 20 cents of the Kuwaiti rate, so you know it’s going to go up at least that far! If it came in at $3 or over, then I would have to ask myself if I want to buy more and watch it go up. Is that really how I want to spend my time, watching the markets and the forex and then jumping on a buy order, maybe in the middle of the night? If you don’t know how to do forex, that’s a pain. On the other hand, Kuwait went briefly up to $10-12 – if you had the courage or nerves to wait for that moment to sell at the peak. If you don’t have the time and confidence to watch for that, then I wouldn’t do it.
Caller: It really looks like it could happen at any time. How confident are YOU on that happening within the next 72 hours?
Tony: I said Friday because it makes sense – the rate is stabilized because it’s not moving on Forex, and all the banks will offer the same rates. That makes sense to me. Is it scheduled for before the weekend? Yes, but it was for last week as well. They are able to do it, but it’s a question of how fast they can get these other side issues sorted out before the release. On Monday, everyone in Washington was all excited, but when it came to those making the final decision, they said, “Nope, there are things that are not ready that you don’t know about.” So it could go before Friday… the weekend plan makes sense to me, but they do a lot of things that don’t make sense to me. Sometimes these people are looking at a global perspective and we are looking at a local perspective and they don’t always match. I get calls starting at 4.30am to 11.30 last night, and I have to put all that together as best I can to share it with you.
Caller: [Appreciation] I hope to meet you and pick up some of your courage!
Tony: That courage comes with a bullet-proof vest, and Pam’s buying me a tank!
That’s probably enough because DC’s not here. Pam?
Pam: Hang in there. Contact your professionals! Take care of yourself first, and be careful who you trust!
Ray: Enjoy “Wealth-seeking Wednesday”!
Tony: Some info I’m not supposed to give you until the time, but think about all I have told you about exchange procedures, giving your dinar to people…[call cut off] what to expect from people who are out there just to plan your future to be their future. The banks are preparing for all of us, not just groups. There are a whole lot of groups that aren’t even going through, they just think they are – in for a surprise. We are that close, and everything is good. I think it will be a smooth transition. We are all in this together. They are talking about release today, but as I said, in my opinion it will be Friday. It was a pleasure to do this call without DC! DC is key to the information I’ve been giving you, and we appreciate having him on the call. He tried to get in but couldn’t today. So… enjoy your day!


Get Rid Of German Roaches Naturally!

      Get Rid Of German Roaches Naturally!

        May 30, 2014 by Dian Farmer 32 Comments
        Get Rid Of German Roaches Naturally!

        I thought I would share a frugal and safe, natural home remedy for
getting rid of German Roaches.  No one wants roaches, no one wants to
say they have roaches.  But, from time to time we may have to deal
with this issue.

        A few years back we had a MAJOR infestation of German Roaches for a
few years.  First of all we had no idea where they came from and they
spread so quickly.  We had a regular exterminator that came out on
scheduled visits, so I was surprised to see anything.  He asked me if
there was anything new in the house, I said no, and then I remember a
family member had asked us to store a stove for them in our garage.
Well, thee was the culprit.

        He told us that German roaches in particular like the taste of
electricity – it tastes sweet.  So, that’s why you see them in
electronic stores and pawn shops, according to him.

        Well, I paid him a lot of money and he was never able to get rid of
them, I paid another exterminator even more money to get rid of them.
Nothing worked, I paid a lot of money for bombs and set them off
repeatedly in every part of the house including the attic – nothing
worked!  I even searched the local flea market for some sort of chalk
that was supposed to kill them when they crossed it, I marked up
everything in the house, but it didn’t work either. We moved and
they followed… It was terrible.

        So, one day I happened upon a “recipe” that promised to rid us of
them, so I thought why not – I have tried everything!  So, I mixed
up Peanut Butter, Sugar, and Baking Soda in a large bowl – cause I
needed a lot!  I the placed a teaspoon in several plastic baggies and
placed them opened in drawers and cabinets all over the house.  In
less than 1 week they were gone!  I mean not a one!  I left the big
bowl full of the leftover concoction out overnight, too.  I was
shocked to say the least!  We had spent over a thousand dollars and
more than a year battling these things and all the while the answer
was in my pantry!

        From my understanding the peanut butter and sugar draw them and the
baking soda kills them.  You can make the same mixture with honey
instead of sugar and with boric acid instead of baking soda, if you
like.  The Dollar Stores sell a large bottle of powdered Boric Acid
for just $1.  I use that outside around doors and windows to keep them


        2 tablespoons peanut butter
 1 cup baking soda or you can use boric acid
 1 cup sugar or you can use honey
 enough water to make a thick paste
 Mix all ingredients together

        – See more at: